30 and 52 move rule

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Re: 30 and 52 move rule

Post by GGWizard » Fri Nov 26, 2010 4:15 pm

mabilisan wrote:sir GGwizard,

Yun pong 16 move perpetual ay hindi nila ginagamit dito sa Salpanna.

Hindi ko maintindihan yung sinasabing advance na lahat ng pieces. Kung ang ibig sabihin ay lahat ng pieces on both sides ay lagpas na halfway sa board, dapat magkatalo na lang sa flag accross. Parang gumgulo na. Me kanya kanya nang interpretation.

Para sa akin, wala na dapat 52 move rule dahil pag meron time limit. Siguro mas acceptable yan kung wala time limit. My position is based sa mga na ipost sa forum na ito.

Thank you.
Sa tingin ko rin may mga parts dito sa 52 move rule na dapat e clarify pa, isa na itong advanced pieces.
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Joined: Sat Apr 12, 2008 10:11 pm

Re: 30 and 52 move rule

Post by juggernaut64 » Fri Jan 07, 2011 6:04 pm

Sir Bobby and all the players on the site,

Sir, with all due respect and courtesy, I totally support the contention of Sir Mabilisan aka alahoy, who is , in real life, Hermie Martinez , one of only around 20 or 30 Senior Strategists in the history of this game we love, therefore, a confirmed Master of the game. Aside from that, he is also the one who did the Official Rating System of the game way back the 70's. And to top it all, if any of you wll come across the brochure or pamphlet that comes with the (official) set, he is the person beside Ronnie Pasola, as both of them were acting as "arbiters" during that historic event. So you see guys, Sir Mabilisan is not only talking through experience but likewise, as an authority and officer of the Federation. His comments should be highly considered and respected.

The great Ronnie Pasola had already foreseen the eventualities that may occur in this game he invented that's why he already came up with enough rules to make the game most exciting. And considering that we even have time limitations now, thanks to the modern technology and the great contribution of Sir Bobby, I reiterate my request that the 52-move rule be abolished as there are only 3 rules, as stipulated in the said "official" competiton rules of the Federation, which can be seen in the said brochure that comes with the set. Allow me to quote these 3 rules are as follows:

Rule No. 12: 30-move Rule:
If no challenge is made after 30 complete moves from the start of the game, the player with more pieces past the mid-point of the board wins the match. If no piece has gone beyond the mid-point or if there is an equal number of pieces beyond the mid-point, the game is automatically declared a draw.

Rule No. 13: 5-move Perpetual:
A 5-move perpetual position results in a drawn game. This happens when an attacked piece, which faces immediate challenge, moves 5-consecutive times (on 2 squares), by the same attacking piece.

Rule No. 14: 16-move Perpetual:
A 16-move perpetual position results in a drawn game. This happens when an attacked piece, which faces immediate challenge, moves 16-consecutive times through more than 2 squares in order to avoid being challenged on the next move, by the same attacking piece.

And again, as Sir Mabilisan said, there is already a time limit so having this 52-move rule totally disrupts the beauty of an ongoing game. Before, when the game is played on actual boards, games even reach as long as 3 hours and the moves may even reach a hundred. Anyway, there is still that last option which is also included in the Official Competition Rules as Rule No. 15, and that is DRAW FOR RESPECT, which is self-explanatory and as in Chess, it is referred to as Grandmasters' Draw.

Hoping to have shed a little light on this utterly confusing rule, I remain

Very truly yours,

Kuya Joel
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Re: 30 and 52 move rule

Post by genRIDEN » Sat Jan 08, 2011 12:46 pm

I support Kuya Joel here and sir Hermie (mabilisan). That's the clarification I asked before about the 52 move rule if this rule is in original rules of the GG Federation. We must still follow that rule.

Thanks kuya Joel for the clarification and follow up about this matter.

Sir Bobby, We hope that we can implement this on the next update...if only possible
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Re: 30 and 52 move rule

Post by Airborne1 » Sat Jan 08, 2011 3:43 pm

I support Kuya Joel and Sir Mabilisan as well. ;-)

Kind regards,
No one respects a person who talks a good game but fails to play by the rule. @.@
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Joined: Sat Apr 12, 2008 8:50 pm

Re: 30 and 52 move rule

Post by UEV » Sun Jan 09, 2011 9:59 am

ui meron na palang senior strategist, hindi ko alam ah, nahuli na talaga ako sa balita...anyway, i was too young wayback that time to meet any...but i personally did organized several tournaments sanctioned by the GGF during the 80s and I have never heard of any 52 move rule...wonder where you guys got it from...UEV
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Re: 30 and 52 move rule

Post by Heihachi » Sun Jan 09, 2011 6:39 pm

Sir Bobby , asan na po reply nyo, were waiting that . tnx po

Suportado ko rin po si sir Joel at Sir Hermie
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Re: 30 and 52 move rule

Post by alahoy » Sun Jan 09, 2011 10:19 pm

Sir Bobby and fellow GG players,

I would like to point out why I am opposed to the 52-move rule (besides the fact that this was not in the original rules of GG). During the time na hindi pa po computerized at "board game" pa lang, when it is obvious that there is a repetition of moves and that there is no challenge that is occurring for a long time ( no specific number of moves) and that a draw is obvious, the players will agree to a draw. Sa 52 move rule po natin dito, the one who made the first challenge can deliberately initiate a series of moves that can force the other player give up a piece or lose via the 52-move rule. During the "board game times", sa endgame obvious na kung there is an inevitable draw. Sa 52 move rule, the advantage is in the player who made the first challenge. Sa board game, yung 16 move rule is applied for a piece under attack for 16 consecutive times and the movement of the piece under attack is more than 2 squares. Dito sa computerized, hindi po applied ito.Therefore, if for example I made the first challenge, and if one of my pieces is under attack, I will just move my piece continuously in more than two squares and eventually win the game via the 52-move rule. In the older times, draw na ito. This example assumes that meron pa enough time left for both players remaining, say 1 minute or more.

As a replacement to the 52-move rule, I am proposing a 72-move rule that will lead to a draw if there is no challenge made after 72 complete moves after the last challenge. Although this rule is not written in the origina rules, this rule will eliminate the advantage of the first player who made the first challenge. We must all remember that when the late Ronnie Pasola formulated the rules, he NEVER gave advantage to the player who will make the first challenge. I am sure if Ronnie were alive, he will agree with me that if a draw is imminent, a draw should be declared and not a win for the player who made the first challenge. Why 72? 72 because there are 72 squares in our game and if you are moving only one piece, naikot mo na yung board wala pang challenge eh dapat siguro talagang draw na.

By the way, I still want the 16-move rule ( an origina rule) be restored.

My apologies to everybody kung hindi po malinaw ang explanation ko. Kung makausap ko sana si Sir Joel, baka mas malinaw ang maging explanation nya sa inyo at sa lahat po.

More power to you, Sir Bobby and your team.
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Re: 30 and 52 move rule

Post by juggernaut64 » Mon Jan 10, 2011 10:19 am

Sir Bobby and all the bossings,

Here are my 2 main points against the 52-move rule:

First, it is not in the official rules of the game; and
Second, which is most devastating to any ongoing game is the fact that no one will surely be able to monitor how many moves have been made since the first challenge, right? In our present playing environment whereby we have timers, that's it, we have timers for the game time, but we don't have a "counter" for the number of moves made.

This supposed rule only ruins a supposed exciting endgame finish as we also have to accept that for a game to last "52 moves" after the first challenge, then that particular game is supposed to have a climactic endgame finish so why give the win to the first challenger when the game should be decided between the players themselves?

In truth, I have only encountered and experienced this ruling three times, and I can only vividly recall the results of the last two, with both games I played with Sir Airborne. In one game, I won but I felt bad because I felt and am sure that I had the advantage pieces and position so that rule simply "robbed" me of that sense of fulfillment as it only gave my opponent (sorry Sir Air) the "excuse" that I won that game through the rule. What's worse is the second game as I was also winning in pieces' quality and position but unfortunately for me, I lost becasue of this ruling. So again, I was robbed. Not only of a win but rather, an exciting end game finish, which I was most confident of winning.

So Sir Bobby and the rest of my bossings here, please forgive me if I insist on the immediate removal of this "rule". Thank you so much for your understanding and wisdom. More power and here's looking forward to a healthy site, most conducive for training and competition, I remain

Very truly yours,

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Re: 30 and 52 move rule

Post by bobby » Mon Jan 10, 2011 5:55 pm

HI Joel, Hermie, UEV, Riden, alahoy, Heihachi, GGWizard, ahihihi, mabilisan, praybit & all,

SalpakanNa is here to implement existing rules. There was a request before to implement 52- and 30-move rule by GenTico for the tournament plans. We have implemented both of them but it seems nobody favors the former.

Your request to remove 52-move rule from the software has been done in the current version v3.1.6.j. There is no more 52-move rule.

The 16-move rule will be implemented in the next version release.

SalpakanNa will remain as a healthy site and conducive for training and competition.

Thanks for the suggestons and support.

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Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2010 5:47 pm

Re: 30 and 52 move rule

Post by Airborne1 » Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:41 pm

Hi Sir Jug,

Mukhang ginulpi mo naman nick ko. Tampo ako, hindi muna kita labanan ng 1 month. :p hihihi

No one respects a person who talks a good game but fails to play by the rule. @.@
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